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  • What have been the most worthwhile threads on the forums?
    Search function must be malfunctioning.
  • What have been the most worthwhile threads on the forums?
    No results in a search for “Plato's Phaedo”
  • The why and origins of Religion
    Coolio!! — 3017amen

    I had to go though the motions of posting a snippet from wikipedia about something that should have been apparent to you from your own postings for you to be cool?

    The worst kind of troll is the one who doesn't realize they're trolling.
  • The why and origins of Religion
    ↪3017amen


    I reference the premier authority in the matter...

    Albert Einstein's religious views have been widely studied and often misunderstood. Albert Einstein stated that he believed in the pantheistic God of Baruch Spinoza. He did not believe in a personal God who concerns himself with fates and actions of human beings, a view which he described as naïve. He clarified however that, "I am not an atheist", preferring to call himself an agnostic, or a "religious nonbeliever." Einstein also stated he did not believe in life after death, adding "one life is enough for me." He was closely involved in his lifetime with several humanist groups. — Wiki Wiki Pedia

    I would express regret for bursting your little bubble, Amen, if I felt any regret.
  • The why and origins of Religion
    ↪3017amen


    I’ll just wait for the street cleaner to do their work.
  • The why and origins of Religion
    ..here's a thought...open up another thread and argue that all of life is rational. I'd be happy to participate :blush: — 3017amen

    Your participation would be incontrovertible proof that such argument is invalid.
  • The why and origins of Religion
    One general observation I would make is that we lack the ability to distinguish religion from philosophical spirituality. Because of the dogmatic attitude of Christianity, everything 'religious' gets tarred with the same brush. — Wayfarer

    I think that I know what you mean but disagree. If we sapiens are good at anything it’s making distinctions.

    Interesting in that philosophy can develop into a science, it can also develop into a religion.
  • The why and origins of Religion
    ↪Wayfarer


    I was wondering if mysticism has anything to do with the Einstein quote about ‘hearing the music of the spheres’ (musica universalis). @3017amen has been no help and he’s the one who posted the quote.
  • The why and origins of Religion
    ↪T Clark


    I’m thinking that you may not have hung out with the folks that 180 was describing on your visit South. Btw, I’m always suspicious of people who “wear their religion on their sleeves” because it feels more like branding than spirituality.
  • What is your perspective on the word: Reflection of self?
    When Master Kyozan Ejaku was master of Tohei Temple, Master Isan Reiyu sent him a letter along with a mirror.

    The package arrived at the temple and Master Kyozan took it with him to the Lecture Hall, held up the mirror and said to his assembly: "Students, Master Isan sent this mirror and it has arrived here. Now I would like you to discuss this for a while. Is this mirror Isan’s or is it Tohei’s? If you say this mirror is now Tohei’s, I will say it is a present from Isan. If you say it was sent from Isan, I will say it is now in the Master of Tohei’s hand. If you can show me the truth I will keep the mirror, if you cannot show me anything I will smash the mirror at once."

    He repeated this three times. Finally, one of the students got up and ran out of the temple towards the hills. Master Kyozan started laughing uncontrollably and accidentally dropped the mirror. It shattered into a million pieces. Master Kyozan then exclaimed, "fuck".
  • The why and origins of Religion
    ↪3017amen


    You're not explaining why. What you're saying only kind of makes sense if we assume that the "music of the spheres" is theism (whatever that entails), since theism is what the atheist objects to, finds dissonant or cannot hear. "appreciate the Harmony in the universe", as you say, appears to mean appreciating God. Note how you capitalize Harmony. We don't need any religious narrative to appreciate the harmony of the universe, do we? Because if we do that seems to mean that we're appreciating the story rather than the actual universe.
  • The why and origins of Religion
    Since music may be considered a universally understood, subjective-truth, it also seems sadly apparent that the fanatical atheist might consider that so-called harmony in the universe as sonic dissonance. — 3017amen

    I'm sure that Einstein was smart enough to distinguish between deafness and dissonance, and that he knew how to say what he meant. In any event, still no clearer as to why the believer may hear sonance and the disbeliever dissonance.
  • Science and Religion. Pros and cons?
    Ha. Every once in a while you right write something worth reading. Succinct and amusing. — DingoJones

    I’ll put you down as an honorary member of my personal fan club. Oh, and I righted your right. Free typo correct is just one of the many perks of being in the praxis fan club. :point:
  • The why and origins of Religion
    You seem to be saying you and Daniel have a logical explanation for consciousness... . — 3017amen

    Maybe I should backup a bit and go back to what initially caught my interest, the claim that atheists cannot hear the music of the spheres. I don’t know the nature of reality or if god exists and in that way I’m not an atheist. I do hope the story in the Bible, and every other religious story I’ve heard, is not true because... it’s some messed up shit, to be perfectly honest. Rather than the "opium of the masses" I’d rather say something like ‘religion is the glue that binds the masses and helps to control them’.

    So given the above, am I deaf to the music of the spheres? If so, does that mean the spheres only play Bible hymns?
  • The why and origins of Religion
    you would rather take the side of the fanatical atheist
    — 3017amen

    Sure, what’s the worst they’ve done? I’m really asking because nothing terrible comes to mind.
    — praxis

    Depends on the context.     — 3017amen

    Daniel Dennett alone in a drawing room holding a candelabra.

    Meaning there can be consciousness without logic. Critters, for example, are conscious and without logic. One might even argue that you’re conscious and without logic.
    — praxis

    Oh, I see. How does that happen, I wonder?     — 3017amen

    Animals don’t have the capability to reason or assess according to strict rules of validity. In your case, who knows.
  • The why and origins of Religion
    you would rather take the side of the fanatical atheist — 3017amen

    Sure, what’s the worst they’ve done? I’m really asking because nothing terrible comes to mind.

    you said consciousness doesn't require logic, what does that mean? — 3017amen

    Meaning there can be consciousness without logic. Critters, for example, are conscious and without logic. One might even argue that you’re conscious and without logic.
  • The why and origins of Religion
    I’m not an atheist. Please exercise better common sense observations.
    — praxis

    I’ll take the reason/science based fanatic
    — praxis

    Because you said the forgoing, in that you would ' take reason/science based fanatic'; was it unreasonable to conclude you were an atheist?     — 3017amen

    I’m not going to even dignify that with an answer, and in any case it doesn’t matter.

    he did not know consciousness itself transcends logic. — 3017amen
    You contend that only a religion could inform him of that?
    — praxis

    The short answer to that short question is, I would contend that both science and religion are not mutually exclusive.     — 3017amen

    It feels like you’re being evasive. There’s no need for that, I’m totally harmless. Anyway, you mentioned consciousness transcending logic. Perhaps you could rephrase that because your meaning is unclear. Obviously consciousness doesn’t require logic, but I don’t think that’s what you’re trying to say.

    Planetary bodies emitting sound that we can hear isn’t a good example of a shared truth between science and religion.
  • What is the Problem with Individualism?
    Define, "power", as it seems like we are now talking past each other. — Harry Hindu

  • The why and origins of Religion
    ↪3017amen


    I’m not an atheist. Please exercise better common sense observations.

    ... he did not know consciousness itself transcends logic. — 3017amen

    You contend that only a religion could inform him of that? And please exercise better grammar. I couldn’t interpret your double negative.
  • The why and origins of Religion
    “The fanatical atheists are like slaves who are still feeling the weight of their chains which they have thrown off after hard struggle. They are creatures who—in their grudge against traditional religion as the "opium of the masses"—cannot hear the music of the spheres.” ― Albert Einstein — 3017amen

    Despite his genius I guess Albert didn’t know that sound can’t travel in a vacuum. And if it’s a choice between fanatics, I’ll take the reason/science based fanatic over the ‘I believe whatever sky father (ordinary guy wearing robes and funny hat) tells me’ fanatic, because history shows that the latter is capable of any atrocity.
  • Is Stoicism a better guide to living than Christianity
    ... the values that permeate western culture are largely based on Christianity even for those who don't believe in God. — Ross Campbell

    If true that would be a sufficient condemnation for me.

    is Stoicism a better guide to living than Christianity and should it replace the latter as a set of values to live by? — Ross Campbell

    Religion is for those who, for whatever reason, are not inclined towards self-actualization and religion could be rather superfluous for the self-actualized. The fundamental incompatibility is that stoicism relies on reason whereas religion relies on faith. The former leads to independence and the development of virtue and the latter to dependence and “the values that permeate western culture”.
  • Science and Religion. Pros and cons?
    Pros of science: iPhone

    Cons of science: A-bomb

    Pros of religion: Grace

    Cons of religion: Jihad
  • The Red Zones Of Philosophy (Philosophical Dangers)
    ↪180 Proof


    I did, but looking again I notice the other topic title.
  • The Red Zones Of Philosophy (Philosophical Dangers)
    ↪180 Proof


    I'm curious why you use the term 'optimism' rather than denial, short-sightedness, or the like.
  • What is the Problem with Individualism?
    ↪Possibility


    I’d say that the line between pre-birth and after-birth is arbitrary, and we touched on this earlier with Tzeentch‘s claim that ‘all people are born free’. Babies are utterly dependent and have yet to develop a self-identity. A newborn is more an extension of the mother than an independent being, in other words. At least that’s how I see it. Religious folk will see it differently of course.
  • The Unfortunate Prevalence of Nothing-But-ism
    Is it the case that all isms are essentially nothing-but-isms? — Janus

    Isms are nothing but nothing-but-isms.
  • What is the Problem with Individualism?
    I can relate to this experience throughout my two pregnancies: the notion of a part of your bodily system ‘expressing its individuality’ by responding in its own way to certain foods, bodily movements/positions or environmental factors (sounds, temperature, etc)... — Possibility

    Men too can certainly relate to a body part reacting to stimulus in a way that may not be inline with conscious will. The reaction nevertheless has a purpose and isn’t random or arbitrary.
  • Has this site gotten worse? (Poll)
    I’m not really seeing what others are referring to as a bias. So far, I don’t think I’ve seen one thread where everybody agreed with the OP. It doesn’t matter what your opinion is, someone on here will disagree with you about it. It isn’t an echo chamber by any means, imo. — Pinprick

    Anti-group-think group-think, maybe that’s a thing?
  • What is the Problem with Individualism?
    ↪NOS4A2


    A system is a set of things working together as parts of a mechanism or an interconnecting network. Even you should be able grasp this rather simple concept. Your body, for instance, could be seen as a set of organs working together as parts of a, uh, largely functional individual. None of your organs functions are arbitrary, they each fit into the system in a particular way. There is an order, a system! If your bladder decided that it was an individual and had to express its individuality by peeing whenever you read the word "communist", well, you'd be sitting in a pool of urine right now and wishing your bladder were more responsible.
  • What is the Problem with Individualism?
    Shortly after birth one is excised from his mother, thereby severing any connection to anyone else. There's nothing arbitrary about this very real uncoupling. Indivisibility beyond this point means death. — NOS4A2

    Or life, in the form of offspring.

    What is arbitrary is any notion of responsibility toward others, towards some collective, even towards one's newborn. — NOS4A2

    It could only be arbitrary if there were no system (social, ecological, or whatever), but there is a system, so it's actually the case that the freer an individuals is the more responsibility they have and the less responsibility they assume the more arbitrary (loss of order) the system becomes.
  • What is the Problem with Individualism?
    CEO's are individuals that have acquired their power not through their work alone. — Harry Hindu

    What does that have to do with it, no one acquires their power through their work alone.
  • Has this site gotten worse? (Poll)
    It is not the forum that is special. I am. The forum is just a medium that enabled me to use it advantageously, but to imagine some special place it holds is entirely subjective, a fantasy-narrative that imagines meaning more than this subjectivity. — TimeLine
  • Feature requests
    ↪Maw


    You speak as though I were 100% serious. :lol:
  • Has this site gotten worse? (Poll)
    Missing the sticky community that banished S, Timeline and others. :chin:

    Anyways, I propose a solution. Temporarily put the shout-box back on the front side. Maybe some of the glue and vigor will return, and if it does they can then hide the shout-box again.
  • Feature requests
    And unfortunately there are quite a few inane or outright insane posters on this site, so it's difficult to avoid. — Maw

    We only take you about 40% seriously so it all works out nice and tidy.
  • Has this site gotten worse? (Poll)
    I could stand Cormak McCarthy's book The Road, just barely, but not the movie. — Bitter Crank

    I know, was surprised they made a movie of it. I don't mind a good monster story as long as it's not too monstery. Didn't recently make it far into To Sleep in a Sea of Stars, for instance. Morris looks good.
  • What is the Problem with Individualism?
    This is almost right. We seem to have forgotten that a company or corporation is not an individual and therefore doesn't possess rights as an individual. — Harry Hindu

    Actually it is, from a legal standpoint, although the rights are not identical to an actual person. In any case, the president’s or CEO’s can be individualists, can’t they?
  • Does the inner-ear contribute to what we define as balance in our life?
    My wife has had an inner ear infection and suffered vertigo for the last five weeks and only within the last few hours has it completely abated. Her mind has been as balanced as ever for the duration.
  • Has this site gotten worse? (Poll)
    Hail Mary Project by Andy Weir — Bitter Crank

    Haven't been able to find a good sci-fi book lately. Thanks for mentioning.
  • What is the Problem with Individualism?
    ↪James Riley
    :clap:
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