US trolley problem — Mayor of Simpleton

The other day Trump mentioned that corona only affects the elderly or “virtually nobody,” so if these virtual nobodies (including the elderly Trump) are on one track and our big beautiful economy and the precious American Dream are on the other, he seems to suggest that there’s virtually no dilemma.

I was being facetious of course.

Streetlight, what is it exactly that you want in terms of government-type? You're not a liberal, but you say you're not a fascist either. Do you support democracy? Do you just want very considerable restrictions on free speech? — BitconnectCarlos

Not liberal, not a fascist, dubious taste for democracy, and a dislike of free speech. I got it...

Anyways I don’t care to debate this detail anymore because we can at least agree that the Kalama Sutta applies. — khaled

It does not apply to dogma, an issue that you brought up.

On the other hand, you know what they call someone who tries to reform Buddhist doctrine?
— praxis

Where did this come from? Who’s trying to reform Buddhist doctrine? — khaled

Anyone resisting religious dogma.

Instead he complained to the moderator and the crowd and said a few meek comebacks. — darthbarracuda

He spoke directly to the camera, notably, and I’ve seen reports that it was very positive with undecideds. I don’t think Trump is capable of that approach.

I get what you’re saying and think a lot of it has to do with the fact that Biden is uncomfortably feeble both physically and mentally due to age.

Both place pressure on following their doctrines while Buddhism emphasizes that it is strictly optional. — khaled

To be clear, dogma can be a take it or leave it (optional) proposition. On the other hand, you know what they call someone who tries to reform Buddhist doctrine? Not a Buddhist.

the 'kill the Buddha' thing is about transcending intellection and in that way very zen.
— praxis

I don’t see how it would be so I don’t think so. — khaled

I think that the wise nugget you were thinking of is from the Kalama Sutta:

Now, Kalamas, don’t go by reports, by legends, by traditions, by scripture, by logical conjecture, by inference, by analogies, by agreement through pondering views, by probability, or by the thought, ‘This contemplative is our teacher.’ When you know for yourselves that, ‘These qualities are skillful; these qualities are blameless; these qualities are praised by the wise; these qualities, when adopted & carried out, lead to welfare & to happiness’ — then you should enter & remain in them.

Take it or leave it (no corrections allowed).

What sort of sense does this make? — creativesoul

Not a sense thing but a feel thing, I imagine, to the Trump supporters. Empathy can be a powerful ally.

I have the suspicion that if I were to somehow be continuously pleased or fulfilled, or whatever term means the opposite of suffering, that I would have no need for desire. If correct, doesn’t this argument essentially refute Buddhism? — Pinprick

It's not possible to be continuously satisfied because, as the Buddhist say, everything changes. So in essence change is what causes dissatisfaction and without change there is no life. But is change, or anything else for that matter, real? If it's just an illusion then isn't it the illusion, or ignorance of our true nature, that causes suffering?

He’ll get more done in quarantine than Biden has done in 47 years. — NOS4A2

The problem is the attention span of the Trump rally-goer is probably about the length of a gnats, and that’s why he’s forced to do so many of them. In his estimation they must all be losers so it’s doubtful he enjoys their company.

Trump goes all over America doing massive rallies — NOS4A2

Speaking of which, I guess the Hitlarian rile-ups will be put on hold for at least two weeks. Ouch. :grimace:

I hope none of this kerfuffle (kind of a fun word that sounds like it contains popcorn) involves my brobdingnagian appendage. If so, sorry I’ve been dyspraxic (a bad praxis).

The main point of Buddhism is that belief in it is never dogmatic. — khaled

Granted I’m no fan of dogma but the cessation of suffer’n is a bit more appealing, to me.

There is a saying in Buddhist (or zen? I don’t remember) circles “If you see the Buddha by the road, shoot him” which just basically means don’t just follow authorities blindly. — khaled

What religion doesn’t have this take it or leave it attitude? If you decide to walk away from Christianity will they nail you to a cross or something? In any case, you're mixing metaphors, the 'kill the Buddha' thing is about transcending intellection and in that way very zen.

In fact, life is not chaos and disharmony. It requires order and chaos.

For some reason I have encountered a lot of resistance by suggesting that the opponent may have won. People seem to take it to mean that I wanted the opponent to win. — darthbarracuda

I think that’s understandable because by claiming that Trump won the debate suggests that you value his “stream roller” strategy or that your prefer a bully to a moderate. It was certainly a winning strategy for his base, but then he doesn’t need to win them. He already owns them. I think Biden probably did a better job at reaching the undecided, but who knows.

I thought Trump "won" — darthbarracuda

That’s remarkable for someone with 3k+ posts on a philosophy forum, if that suggests valuing truth and reason. I just rewatched the first two segments of the debate after reading your post to see if I missed something. The first question about the SC nomination went reasonably well, no interruptions by either debater, and to be honest Trump’s position and presentation was stronger, I felt. On the second question about healthcare Trump began interrupting badly, like the privileged man-child that he is, and had an extremely weak position (no plan after 4 years! and meaningless executive orders). Biden had the last word and a stronger believable proposition.

Don’t have the stomach to review further.

I was imagining an encyclopedia in line with Borges projection of the world as a library, such that one could wander the realm of knowledge (the encyclopedia) by foot as one can perambulate the actual landscape of the world. — Nils Loc

If pedia is child and encyclius is circularity then the meaning is a child going is circles, as though lost in the woods of knowledge.

ask 180 Proof about how pessimism is the only realistic attitude to adopt.
— TheMadFool

Dear 180 Proof,

How is pessimism the only realistic attitude to adopt? — praxis

@TheMadFool

Looks like either 180 has chosen not to be your personal secretary or you should fire him for being an inattentive minion. Whatever the case, no one can make a successful argument for you that the Four Nobel Truths are factual. In fact, the genius of them is in their fallacious expediency. If a potential follower can deny their own reason and experience right off the bat, and accept this doctrine on faith from an authority, then the rest of the Kool-Aid will be easy to swallow.

ask 180 Proof about how pessimism is the only realistic attitude to adopt. — TheMadFool

Dear @180 Proof,

How is pessimism the only realistic attitude to adopt?

That life is suffering is plain to see. — TheMadFool

No, there’s pleasure or satisfaction also, truth be told.

That craving is, if not the primary cause, at least a major contributor to suffering. That to end suffering, craving has to be ended follows from these premises. — TheMadFool

If craving is only a partial cause then ending it may not do the trick.

Whether the 8-fold path is the correct method to end craving is, unfortunately, debatable. — TheMadFool

So debatable rather than factual.

I assume that you can easily show how the Four Noble Truths are factual.

Ah, he was Great in spirit, I think would be hard to deny.

The Golfers Warehouse?

Yup. I enjoyed some of Biden’s terminology though, like “Putin’s pup.” Glad that I wasn’t completely sober while watching.

No disagreement. I tend to think the best course of action is to put effort into developing a wiser society that’s not as open to manipulation rather than trying to regulate the tools of manipulation. At the risk of sounding paranoid, I imagine that the powers that be want an easily manipulated society and may scheme in some way to maintain it, so all the obstacles in that direction may not be apparent.

Btw, I’ve read about developing AI, or rather GAI, and understand that the potential threat is far far more substantial than any issues with current AI.

AI controlled social media adds another layer to the high rise shit-pile of modern history. — unenlightened

I’ve never been into Facebook, Twitter, instagram, and the like, but I’ve recently developed a habit of using YouTube. The algorithms controlling what it serves up are obvious, and frankly, I wish they were better at serving my interests, but I’m sure that they’ll get smarter as the tech advances. Doubtful an algorithm can make a person narrow-minded, however, at this point. Whatever it is that makes a person want to live in an echo chamber is probably worth looking into.

The spike in teen suicide is disturbing but I haven’t seen enough evidence to be convinced that it’s due to social media. There was a spike around the nineties, for instance, that was comparable. Are there any theories to account for that spike?

Satisfying corporate greed at the expense of consumer well-being, and the science of persuasion, is hardly anything new. Just look at something as mundane and ubiquitous as high fructose corn syrup. It costs less than other sweeteners to produce and improves shelf life, which increases profits for the producers, but the impact it has on the health of consumers must be staggering.

Regarding political divisiveness, some theorize that Trumps success is owed to his Hitler style rallies. Hitler managed to polarize pretty good without the help of online social media. Sorry if I invoke Godwin prematurely.

Jamalrob has done a terrific job of addicting me to this site. I hope his financial reward is great.

Rise of the Warrior Cop: The Militarization of America's Police Forces, by Radley Balko

I’d simply like a SC that doesn’t favor the rich and powerful. I’m a dreamer.

Weirdest of all, the vast majority of Trump supporters are working class and cheer at her nomination.

We’ve learned he has great accountants.

We’ve also learned that they couldn’t drum up any evidence of ties to Russia or paying off stormy Daniels. — NOS4A2

He owes the IRS over 100 million and you’re saying that he has great accountants?

So the New York Times got hold of Trumps tax returns and it turns out that he’s a shitty businessman and cheats on his taxes. Who would have guessed?

Claimed a $72k business expense for doing his weirdass hair. Not a great deal, if you asked me.

For what it’s worth, and due to the unlikelihood that either of these chaps will respond, I recall the Srap Tasmaner-meister mentioning that few are worthy of his attention, so you shouldn’t feeling particularly excluded there.

Banno responds well to blatant flattery, so if you’re willing sell your dignity you could try that. Say that his writing is pretty or something.

Only two days ago:

Left-wingers call each other comrade all the time. You could even call a democratic socialist "comrade" it doesn't matter. I wouldn't call a centrist Democrat "comrade" but then again I'm pretty sure Streetlight isn't a centrist Democratic.

I wouldn't call you comrade. — BitconnectCarlos

If someone pointed out that I was empowering divisive political rhetoric like a mindless puppet, I like to think that I would have the modicum of self-respect required to admit it rather than trying to weasel out of it with the stupid claim that it’s meaningless.

Unnessisay, the point is made, you're programmed to see things in a particular way regardless of appropriateness.

Far left. I don't know Streetlight's political position exactly but I'd wager either socialist or communist, thus the "comrade." — BitconnectCarlos

So you don't know the difference between democratic socialism and communism?

8” x 10” that I’ve titled: Still-Life with The Kauai Beer Company Growler and Red Tandem Brewery Government Warning Label with “Machete Rojo”* scribbled On It and Home Garden Golden Jubilee Tomato on Vertically Striped Fabric Background.

Kind of a long and explicit title but hey, who cares.

* Not a great brew

But hey, who would have known that in this particular instance it's actually right? Streetlight is very far left if we're going by the typical political spectrum and I don't think he would deny that. — BitconnectCarlos

Deny that he's far left or a red fascist?

For Neoplatonists, the All is all three: unity + multiplicity. — frank

You seem to be missing one.