You seem to love your role as a pompous, third-rate, unlicensed psychiatrist. It’s something you do a lot, but I think this thread was particularly egregious. I always worry someone vulnerable will take you seriously. I think what you said to TimeLine (“you still love him”) was the most disrespectful thing I ever heard said to her, and that’s saying a lot. In the good old days, she would have kicked you till you bled. You deserve to be rhetorically horsewhipped. Sorry TL, I know you don’t need me to defend you. — T Clark
This is a philosophy forum after all. Maybe we should refocus our efforts there. I think fdrake is partially right, but I really don't need to hear how you're really a good guy and good husband. I trust that's true and have moved on. — Hanover
Ok, so I'm learning something new. You're saying that it is normal for a woman to be afraid of her husband. — frank
However, let me be crystal clear, I had no idea who made the quote you asked me to address and I don't regret being brutally honest with you. I do however feel as though I have been slighted by myself for not reading back to who said it before I answered. I would never want to hurt someone for being honest and this is a place that I am just now reconsidering a "safe place" to share and for that reason I offer my apologies to T Clark for not researching the quote. — ArguingWAristotleTiff
Thank you for saying what I was trying to get at. You did it so much better than I could ever. It took courage. I know it also means you trust us, which means a lot to me. — T Clark
And T-Clark, I'm more than happy for you to be insulted by what I said. It was totally in earnest and I really wanted Tiff's response to it. I wasn't trying to insult your wife. — frank
So what this is really about is Peterson. I had been thinking it was all naturalistic fallacy crap, but the post of two people in this thread have had me rethinking it. It's not about nature, although those less likely to think things through might think that. It's about patriarchy. I think at one point we thought it was a social construction and we were so smart we could just think our way out of it and create a different world. Maybe we hadn't noticed that if we think of it as a life-form, patriarchy is at least 5000 years old. Do I see signs in my world that it's dying. I've got to be honest: no, I don't. — frank
And so what is the pragmatic solution? Do you rise up and give the woman the chance to drive the bus in order to create a better future for better prepared women, or do you offer it to the man who already has been groomed for this moment and is for entirely unfair reasons better prepared for the dangerous task at hand and will provide a greater likelihood of success? — Hanover
It is my observation that relations between men and women are strongly affected by fear. — T Clark
The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe.“Aslan is a lion- the Lion, the great Lion." "Ooh" said Susan. "I'd thought he was a man. Is he-quite safe? I shall feel rather nervous about meeting a lion"..."Safe?" said Mr Beaver ..."Who said anything about safe? 'Course he isn't safe. But he's good. He's the King, I tell you.” — C.S. Lewis
Well Edgar is an alcoholic. He's going to crash the bus into a ditch in the middle of Nowhere, whereas Melissa actually has amazing eye-hand coordination, nerves of steel, and could fly an F-15 if she wanted to. Edgar gets up because he thinks he's supposed to. Melissa sits there for the same reason. — frank
Yeah, but this attacks the hypothetical, which is that the unfair advantages afforded certain people provide them long term benefits of success. The way you've interpreted it, the social limitations are just artificial protections for power. — Hanover
Social norms cultivate talents and strength in one population and spray herbicide on another. Our efforts to create more fairness may have limited success and be short term, not because we don't see the problem, or that we don't care, but that we don't have ultimate control of the social forms we inhabit. That's what I was trying to say. Do you agree with that? — frank
Shall we say then, that a relationship without fear is a relationship without investment or commitment - a complacent relationship? — unenlightened
Shall we say then, that a relationship without fear is a relationship without investment or commitment - a complacent relationship? — unenlightened
The pragmatic question is how painful we will allow the transitional period to be where we afford less qualified people to become more qualified. I think the society that invests now will be in a better position later when all its members are then as fully capable as the rest, but for those living in the here and now, it could be a painful process. — Hanover
It happened on here too between Agu and someone else, I think it was Vagabond and they both looked just as stupid as the other, writing massive essays without contributing intellectually at all. When I said that they should stop and actually talk about the problem in the OP, I got 'no, we have to do this.' Women back away because we know we get brushed aside during this weird Alpha display. There is no problem in condescension as you may genuinely disagree with the content of the response you receive, but it should be as a critique and with adequate solutions the problem.
Constipatedly homoerotic ritual? :lol: :lol: — TimeLine
That's not the kind of thing I'm talking about, the kind that damages relationships can kill love. Not some sort of sacred fear. — T Clark
I'm all done for now. — T Clark
Perhaps it is a uniquely male theme; we measure ourselves against one another to appropriately divide reproductive access to the females...
Men are fighty, women are picky, and I'm risen here to combat your peculiar sexual conservatism that would mock these ancient and sacred games we play... — VagabondSpectre
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