What do you mean by ‘negative impact’? — Brett
Some are ignored, isolated or excluded by elements of their environment - — Possibility
Okay. So I understand water, and I understand light. Which is less complex? Your standard of measurement is "I believe I understand it" and "I don't understand it." This is binary. There is no gradation. There is no metric, other the "complex" and "Not complex". You can't, by this metric, differentiate between complex and complex, and between simple and simple.Our knowledge evolves from the simple to the complex.
Simple is what you believe you understand. Complex is what you still do not understand.
We have more understanding over the properties of light than consciousness.
We have far more control over light than we have over consciousness. — ovdtogt
We have far more control over light than we have over consciousness. — ovdtogt
Would you not consider your ability to direct your own thoughts to be indicative of a high degree of control over consciousness? — Pantagruel
Our ability to control our thoughts is vastly inferior to our ability to control light. — ovdtogt
"I believe I understand it" and "I don't understand it." This is binary. There is no gradation. — god must be atheist
Egad! I've never met anyone who could control light with his or her thoughts before. You must be barrels of fun at parties! — Pantagruel
Since consciousness is doing the external controlling, wouldn't consciousness itself first have to be controlled to do the external controlling? — Pantagruel
Scientists and engineers are also conscious, so the same question applies to them. If the scientist is able to create a theory that facilitates external control of some thing, a fortiori the scientist must be controlling his or her thoughts. — Pantagruel
Thus the degree of control I have over the light is contingent on the degree of control I have over my own intentions. — Pantagruel
The degree to which you understand how a the engine of a motor vehicle works. That can be from knowing how to drive it to being able to repair it. They are all degrees of knowledge from the simple to the complex. — ovdtogt
Right, and you pointed out that whole mechanism was the product of prodigious thought effort.t does not require high degree of thought control to flip a light switch. — ovdtogt
If you can't control thought, you can't logically be said to control anything else. It isn't a parallel process, it is linear. — Pantagruel
I think I offered a pretty robust explanation of the linear connection between control of thought and control of what is external to thought, plus the a fortiori justification, so I'm going to have to assume you are just quibbling now and aren't really interested in furthering the overall argument. I don't do that.Show me where I stated you can't control your thoughts. — ovdtogt
This you said in relation to how complex a system IS.
How complex a given system IS, is a fixed state. It is stagnant, not dynamic.
But you now say that a system can be complex and more complex. — god must be atheist
Thus the degree of control I have over the light is contingent on the degree of control I have over my own intentions. — Pantagruel
Yes that is exactly what I said. Yes, our ability to control 'stuff' is very dependent on the complexity of its properties. It is far easier to control light than it is to control how a drug behaves in your body. Our ability to control light was the one of the first achievements of the Enlightenment. It was one of the easiest problems to solve so to speak. — ovdtogt
If you can't control your intentions you can't control anything. What is your point? — ovdtogt
the thing over which you exert the highest degree of control is always going to be your own thoughts, or consciousness. — Pantagruel
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