Then it would seem what you found offensive was the fact they knocked on your door saying things you thought stupid, and insulted you on the internet, not the fact they were transgender or feminist. Why bring up gender ideology, or feminism in that case?until the later comes knocking on my door spouting stupidities and the former insulting me on the internet — Terran Imperium
Human sexuality is an objective biological binary trait: 'XY' and 'XX' are genetic markers of health, not genetic markers of a disorder. — Terran Imperium
What's really keeping them together, that's some other chemicals entering into play that I'm not going to go into details on but basically those chemicals aren't produced as much after they birthed a child or more, its because the body deemed its initial purpose of perpetuating the human species as done. That means divorce rates go up after having children, yes. — Terran Imperium
If it causes no harm to others, it shouldn't matter that X is biologically male or female but identifies otherwise. — Ciceronianus the White
Ah. So if we merely treat them as we would anyone else, we encourage them. Yes, that makes sense.So, its NOT harmful to encorage someone's delusions to the point where they allow a doctor to cut them up on a surgical table for profit? — Harry Hindu
Here is the thing since you seem incapable of understanding the context of my words. I spoke in my first post why I was insulted on the internet in the first place. It revolves around the transgender and the feminist movement. I started this discussion to understand them better and lay out my way of thinking and my view on them if you read my first posts, you will see what I am talking about.Then it would seem what you found offensive was the fact they knocked on your door saying things you thought stupid, and insulted you on the internet, not the fact they were transgender or feminist. Why bring up gender ideology, or feminism in that case? — Ciceronianus the White
Blah blah blah blah blah.
You have way to many false premises for me even to begin. — Blue Lux
You fatalistic, abject muppet! — Blue Lux
Prove that the hyle's existence and authenticity is the result of a neural impulse
Faith is all you have! — Blue Lux
I will not answer someone who doesn't seem capable of formulating a proper argument. I think if you reword it more politely and in a way everyone can understand, people then might consider you words. Otherwise, you are just making a fool out of yourself.In other words... The aetiological state of affairs based on this abstraction necessitates this abstraction delivering us to the conclusion that this abstraction is a truthful abstraction.
What a truth you have ascertained! — Blue Lux
Yes, it is harmful when you are treating someone with mental disillusions, normally, or in a more extreme example, treating a murderer, normally. Its a denial of the reality in front of them. Certainly when they demand of people to use previously unknown pronouns for their unique person. What a level of pretentiousness and ego. I will not change my language to fit someone's delusional world nor agree with their political view.Ah. So if we merely treat them as we would anyone else, we encourage them. Yes, that makes sense. — Ciceronianus the White
This is your post I was responding to. I can understand being annoyed by people who, uninvited, knock on your door to declaim something or another, or who insult you on the Internet. So, I suggested that's what you found objectionable, not the fact they're transgender or feminist. But, your last response to me was to the effect that my suggestion was inaccurate. If that's the case, though, it would seem we may infer that you do, indeed, find it objectionable that people are transgender or feminist.If you read my previous posts more carefully, you'll notice that I didn't particularly care nor put much attention to the transgender people or the feminists until the later comes knocking on my door spouting stupidities and the former insulting me on the internet. No one would dedicate time to talk about a subject they aren't concerned about or doesn't affect them in any way. I'll be pretty stupid and hateful if I despised those people for no reason what so ever. — Terran Imperium
What I meant is, the initial subject is as to why they come knocking at my door and as to why I was insulted in the first place. It all comes down back to feminism and transgenderism and their ideologies which I don't particularly agree with and their intrusive nature when I didn't ask for it in those cases.This is your post I was responding to. I can understand being annoyed by people who, uninvited, knock on your door to declaim something or another, or who insult you on the Internet. So, I suggested that's what you found objectionable, not the fact they're transgender or feminist. But, your last response to me was to the effect that my suggestion was inaccurate. If that's the case, though, it would seem we may infer that you do, indeed, find it objectionable that people are transgender or feminist.
That's unfortunate, but it's not their problem, nor should you make it a problem for them. — Ciceronianus the White
And, by this definition trans-genderism is the matter of somebody's personal self-identification. Both definitions open a way for changing gender. But what about "no gender"?According to the Oxford Living Dictionaries:
"A state or condition in which a person's identity does not conform unambiguously to conventional ideas of male or female gender."
According to this definition, Trans-genderism is the matter of ideology.
According to the Cambridge Dictionary:
"The condition of someone feeling that they are not the same gender (= sex) as the one they had or were said to have at birth." — Terran Imperium
That is obviously not possible. You are either female or male. You can't be something in between or a third weird gender, especially as we humans are a mammalian species. There are only two genders. Its a fact that cannot change.And, by this definition trans-genderism is the matter of somebody's personal self-identification. Both definitions open a way for changing gender. But what about "no gender"? — Number2018
It is a problem from my point of view but I won't go whining about it nor crying out in the roof of my house like they do. There is a common rule among doctors is that you can't force a treatment down a patient's throat. The patient has the right to refuse to be treated and so are the transgender people and the feminists. There is a reason they are around on the news everywhere. Because they can't stop making a problem out of everything and it's annoying the hell out of me and everyone generally. — Terran Imperium
Not only trans-gender people but those that thinks there is more than two genders. A non-binary gender? Really? — Terran Imperium
This gender ideology contradicts basic biology.
Human sexuality is an objective biological binary trait: 'XY' and 'XX' are genetic markers of health, not genetic markers of a disorder. — Terran Imperium
That is obviously not possible. You are either female or male. You can't be something in between or a third weird gender, especially as we humans are a mammalian species. There are only two genders. Its a fact that cannot change. — Terran Imperium
you can't force a treatment down a patient's throat — Terran Imperium
You can't pretend to be something when you aren't — Terran Imperium
That is obviously not possible. You are either female or male. You can't be something in between or a third weird gender, especially as we humans are a mammalian species. There are only two genders. Its a fact that cannot change. — Terran Imperium
It wasn't how I started the discussion, it wasn't even the main subject of our discussion and I barely mentioned it in a few words in 300 words long post, they only nitpicked that and started a heated debate that I didn't want anything in.To treat this as a simple issue, well, your initial post makes it clear you don't understand the basics of the topic at hand. You may have been insulted by whoever (I don't care honestly), but you are probably partly to blame if you acted as you did in your OP. Calling transgender people delusional, calling people you disagree with delusional, using dictionary definitions over the definitions used in academia. These do not endear you to anyone, it would piss me off if this was how you started your other discussion because it doesn't even meet the minimum of niceties one expects in discussions. — MindForged
Look, you can't. It's a biological reality. There aren't 17 genders, It's a fact that you can't change, it's how humanity is built and more than a few species actually.That reveals a rather striking lack of imagination. You could have 17 genders if all of them had a different historical basic function toward reproduction and gestation. There is absolutely nothing which demands that it gender be binary, other then the convenience and usefulness of it being so. — Akanthinos
That's just jumping around the context of my words.Of course you can. The patient may not like it, it may not be legal, it's very bad manners, but it is definitely possible. — Bitter Crank
Same here. Of course, my choice of word might have been poor. Although as I said the context of my words were pretty clear about that.Of course you can. Anyone can "pretend" anything. The audience may not believe the fakery, the fakery may not be performed very well, and one may not be rewarded for one's efforts, but it is possible. — Bitter Crank
This is something I agree with completely and it's an opinion I support.One of the phenomena we are confronted with a lot these days is excessive sensitivity to real or imagined slights, an epidemic of narcissism, and extremely inflexible ideology. So you have people whose ideology (feminism, just one of several) is very reactive. They are always set to go off when stepped on (like land mines), and their bellyaching is amplified in an echo chamber.
Of course it's possible for a man to imagine he is a woman, and visa versa. If they are good actors, he can fake it convincingly. Ditto for women who imagine they are men. I say, "Go right ahead. Imagine what you want, and if you can pull it off, you can act as if your fantasies are real. If you can't, people will just laugh at you. If you are an interesting person (whatever else you are) I'll be polite--I might even want to be your friend. What I won't do is join the show. I'm not going to pretend that you are actually a woman. If you have a penis, testicles, beard, xy chromosomes, and so on--all in working order, you can go to a chop shop and get remodeled, take estrogen, get your breasts enlarged, change your hair, wardrobe, etc. and you may look just like a woman. But to me you are still a man, (and visa versa if you are a woman imagining herself to be a man). — Bitter Crank
Look, you can't. It's a biological reality. There aren't 17 genders, It's a fact that you can't change, it's how humanity is built and more than a few species actually. — Terran Imperium
Those are what you call an exception. People with DSD or hermaphrodite persons does not constitute a third sex. You do not use exceptions as a generalization. It's a genetical deficiency, you do not use an illness as a general truth.Bloody christ you are arguing from ignorance. Intersex and androginy are real things. — Akanthinos
A woman can behave with a manly attitude, that's what people call a tomboy. Do you know the difference between a tomboy and a transgender man?
Thank you since you provided me an actual argument here. The thing is my point still apply here if I'm wearing Jordans, it doesn't mean I'm telling people I am male! It's just a fashion preference.I didn't talk about attitudes or personality. I brought up more tangible things: how people dress according to how their society deems appropriate for their gender (colors and style, for example), bodily features that are usually associated with a particular biological sex but aren't exclusive to it, the kind of norms (especially social) we apply to particular genders. — MindForged
I apologize in advance if I am offending you or your friend in the following words.The tomboy comparison isn't sufficient here. I've a transwoman whose a friend of mine who's a music professor. She used to tell me how she knew she was different since she was a kid for various reasons: she preferred to play with "girl toys", she would take every opportunity to dress and act like a woman, and had visceral reactions to depictions of herself in typically male dress and such. She wasn't delusional, she had (and still has, if less so) gender dysphoria. She wasn't delusional, it's just her gender identity does not match what is expected from her sex.
Short of presupposing that she is inherently wrong for being the way she is, I don't see what the argument is here. Perhaps some people go too far in their views about sex and gender. I don't know, I don't personally have a great deal of interest in it. But the core of it seems extremely plausible unless we make arbitrary moral assumptions and completely disregard people's experience despite hat experience playing a crucial role in how they view and act with respect to the gender they have. — MindForged
The thing is my point still apply here if I'm wearing Jordans, it doesn't mean I'm telling people I am male! It's just a fashion preference. — Terran Imperium
It is indeed. Its a common double standard in favor of women, unfortunately. Another example is, old women, oiling up a handsome young muscled man is good but old men oiling up a hot and fit young woman is creepy. I noticed that even in my mind it sounded creepy while I thought the former one is not but when you compare them... It's different and it change your perspective, it makes you take a step back and think about it for a second. It actually gives me chills by how societal biases affect my way of thinking on a day to day basis even when I'm considering myself to be an objective and logical person.Shoes are less contentious. If you were a man and wore dresses the situation would be much different. — MindForged
andThat's just jumping around the context of my words. — Terran Imperium
Same here. Of course, my choice of word might have been poor. Although as I said the context of my words were pretty clear about that. — Terran Imperium
Well you certainly are a crank. ... Where have I heard this song and dance from before? — MindForged
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