I don't think this quite cuts it. If responsibility were an arbitrary convention, how can it play a dynamic role in our personal and social life? Again, what would motivate anyone to give an arbitrary convention a central role in social interaction? Wouldn't such centrality be completely irrational and long-since recognized as such? — Dfpolis
If it's not subjective, then it obtains independently of what anyone thinks about it. What would be the evidence of that? — Terrapin Station
I am not saying that responsibility has no subjective element, but that it is not entirely subjective. Responsibility is a relation between a subject and a forseeable, objective state of affairs that would not be, had the subject not acted as he or she did. — Dfpolis
I do not believe that mental phenomena cause changes in the brain as you do. If mental phenomena were causally efficacious, then wouldn’t it be possible for telekinesis to occur? It is much more likely that mental phenomena supervenes on the physical brain. This is knowable a fortiori. It is consistent and coherent with neuroscience. Your claim is not. — Noah Te Stroete
No, you're not getting the idea. If there's a supervenience relation, one can't obtain without the other. Planets could still exist if we didn't. — Terrapin Station
A supervenience relation there doesn't exclude either the notion that mental, aesthetic properties are physical or nonphysical. — Terrapin Station
Agreed. So what philosophic value does the supervenience relation have? How does it help us develop a consistent understanding of human experience? — Dfpolis
Hive society animals have a completely different form than our own so I feel your comparison is unfair. You use hive insects as the example for all social animals and that is a mistake, at the very best we could be compared to other primates but not insects. — Jamesk
Unless you think that morals are a natural feature of the world, which i do not, I also don't think comparing us to other species is helpful either, — Jamesk
Responsibility is a social convention simply because people believe in free will, not because it is metaphysically true. — Noah Te Stroete
The thesis was that responsibility is explained by us being social animals. If this were true, then a responsibility relation would be a feature of all social animal groups. — Dfpolis
My claim is that mental phenomena supervene on the physical brain. Some difference in the brain is necessary for a change in the mental processes. Also the brain supervenes on mental processes. Any change in mental processes necessitate changes in the brain. Hence, my assertion that there is supervenience BETWEEN mental processes and the brain. — Noah Te Stroete
It seems to me that a person can be said to have an absolutely free will only if that person is in some mysterious sense self-created; that is, only if that person, in some way, was able to choose who they are (their character).
For, ultimately, it is the person's character which determines the motives to which he/she responds, or does not respond, and it is their character for which he/she feels responsible.
This I learned from Arthur Schopenhauer! — charles ferraro
This is also what Strawson Jr. is arguing. But my question is - so what? If that's how you define "absolutely free will," then, obviously, that's how it is. But how is this "absolutely free will" - a made-up thing that cannot possibly exist - relevant to any human concerns? — SophistiCat
This is also what Strawson Jr. is arguing. But my question is - so what? ... [H]ow is this "absolutely free will" ... relevant to any human concerns? — SophistiCat
You could say this with almost any "problem" of philosophy. That's why the average person couldn't care less about philosophy. — Noah Te Stroete
H]ow is this "absolutely free will" ... relevant to any human concerns? — SophistiCat
If anyone wishes to demonstrate that "mental phenomena have physical effects," one needn't appeal to such arcana as experiments purporting to demonstrate telekinesis: anyone who has had a desire for some peanuts and gotten up to kitchen to get some has ably demonstrated that mental states can have physical effects. — Arkady
One problem with your theory is proving that mental states exist at all. Most recent research shows that on average our sub-conscious sends the message the body to get up and get peanuts about half a second before you think you have decided to do it. — Jamesk
If we think that mental states might not exist, then what the heck are we even talking about in the "before you think you have decided to do it" part? — Terrapin Station
There seem to be only two choices, one, that it was determined and the other that it was random or spontaneous. — Jamesk
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