Because this is very rare. You can always find outliers to justify your general attitude, but it ignores the wider and much more important data.
"If."
but when it comes to the American Dream of "if you just work hard enough, sky's the limit," we all have to become delusional.
Yeah, and those grapes they eat are probably sour anyway.
"Probably right." I love this. I guess you're a true believer in the American dream. Fine. Don't let me disillusion you if it makes you happy. But in my view, it's a complete delusion
I honestly don't even care what people do or how much they earn, but if someone is going to do nothing to even attempt to get their situation in order and then blame the system on it I'm so done with them.
— BitconnectCarlos
Here is the relevant part of your response. It's exactly this sentiment that's wrong. It's in the same group as the old "Welfare Queen" belief, which still persists. Why? Because this is very rare. You can always find outliers to justify your general attitude, but it ignores the wider and much more important data. — Xtrix
Escaping poverty is very rare? I don't think so. — BitconnectCarlos
"If."
That issue is retirement. Shouldn't be too hard to recognize. If someone is earning decent money and does not save any of it and wakes up at age 65 one day and is annoyed that they have to keep working then I'm sorry but you've made your own bed. — BitconnectCarlos
"Probably right." I love this. I guess you're a true believer in the American dream. Fine. Don't let me disillusion you if it makes you happy. But in my view, it's a complete delusion
Then why has my family done it? Why did I grow up around people who also did it? Apparently none of us exist in your world. — BitconnectCarlos
No, Welfare queens and other outlier examples, which are used to justify cutting funding and a general hatred towards the poor, are rare. I put the entire context in -- in case it was an accident that you left it out.
Sure. What's your point?
I'm sure plenty of people do it, as I've stated before. Many more try very hard and fail to do so.
I get it. I’m not welcome here. I can take a hint. — NOS4A2
Financial responsibility is first and foremost a personal responsibility. — BitconnectCarlos
Are you saying that people are poor because they are not financially responsible?
I don’t call people names and compare them to cartoon characters. That’s the bag of you and your fellow travellers, who opine about character and divisiveness out of one side of the mouth while engaging in snark and ridicule out the other. Politics is all about division. If you cannot handle an opposing opinion it’s probably not for you.
Well, you are talking to people on a Philosophy Forum, so I think a lot of people are familiar with the juxtaposition "what is interesting" / "what is good for your career and future income" when picking subjects to study.Personally, I think people should work with their strengths. I have a few friends who are quieter guys and good students and they do fine as engineers. I know other who, while okay students, are much more charismatic and have been doing well as salespeople. School shouldn't break the bank. There's also trade school, but in practice many of the upper middle class wouldn't want to send their child there out of pride. It's totally a pride thing. — BitconnectCarlos
Yes on both counts; I'm on the mend, and the surgery didn't involve the vocal cords. The tonsil and lymph nodes were the sites of the malignancy, and the pathology report showed no cancerous cells in any of the margins. A 'robotic' system was used to remove the internal tissue (the "Davinci surgical robot") which is entirely under the control of the surgeon, and then the external surgery (removing lymphatic tissue) was the traditional knife and fork method. It took about 4 hours. Radiation is not necessary, ditto for chemo--for the future, as far as they can tell, but no guarantees. — Bitter Crank
I had a fantasy of the surgical robot getting loose and stalking humans in the hospital hallways, over-powering them, and forcing its favorite surgical procedures on them. — Bitter Crank
I'm sure plenty of people do it, as I've stated before. Many more try very hard and fail to do so.
I just can't believe you when you say that the American dream is a myth or like winning the lottery when I grew up in a neighborhood where most people were maybe 1st or 2nd generation immigration who came over to the US with not much money and yet here we are in a decent neighborhood. You make out economic mobility to be a myth when I just don't think that's the case. — BitconnectCarlos
Are you saying that people are poor because they are not financially responsible?
Not necessarily, but this is the case for some people. — BitconnectCarlos
it seems to me you believe we're not in fact living in a rigged economy and plutocracy, and that systemic biases either don't exist or are minimal.
When you say "rigged" I think casino games. — BitconnectCarlos
One thing you should remember. The US has also done well. That it has avoided the ugly side of socialism has it's positive side too. Don't think that things couldn't be worse! They surely could.Look at the consequences of these policies. It's been around 40 years or so, since Reagan and the beginning of the "neoliberal" era, and had run though every administration. We're living with the results. — Xtrix
Because socialism in the Marxist-Leninist way doesn't work! It ruins the economy and creates in the end in the best case a stagnant backward economy with few incentives and a multitude of problems. At worst it create a catastrophe, just like in Venezuela. — ssu
Hillary to the rescue. That's my prediction. DNC will nominate Hillary. — fishfry
Hillary to the rescue. That's my prediction. DNC will nominate Hillary.
— fishfry
Wait you actually think this? — StreetlightX
Plenty of political commentators have made the same point.
— fishfry
I'm honestly curious who these commentators are — Maw
Your counterargument doesn't make the point, because I've made the distinction quite clear between social democrats and true marxist-leninists and I've said multiple times that Sanders is a social democrat.This comparison is unjust. Sanders is by all means not fixated of nationalizing everything in the market. Only some more regulation and much needed higher taxes on the ultra-rich. His policies should lead to higher GDP growth in the long term if that's the only thing that matters to Joe or Sandy. — Shawn
Get involved in philosophical discussions about knowledge, truth, language, consciousness, science, politics, religion, logic and mathematics, art, history, and lots more. No ads, no clutter, and very little agreement — just fascinating conversations.