Is not very death oriented. Is oriented - to the extent that it is so oriented - to the possibility of death, and what it means to be a person, dasein, that is going to die. Thus not about death itself at all, but about life. Maybe that's what you meant.Heidegger's analysis is very death oriented. — Gregory
I am talking to my father about going to visit my mother's grave. There is an obvious irreversible time sequence. — David Mo
Anyone can perceive a similar one without the need for theories. — David Mo
Heidegger's claim that the future is primordial needs to be argued. — David Mo
But it would be absurd to ask for reasons that my mother's death is prior to the conversation that precedes the visit to her grave. — David Mo
If all perception includes theory, the pre-discursive knowledge that is the basis of Heidegger's theory and his critique of metaphysics and science is also theory. — David Mo
You do not distinguish between talking about a person's death and that the person is dead. When did my mother's death occur? In my memory? Is my mother's death "theoretical"? — David Mo
Heidegger's claim that the future is primordial needs to be argued.
— David Mo
Temporality is primordial, not just the future. — Xtrix
Heidegger says that the future is the primordial existential ecstasis. — David Mo
The main reason is that the authenticity of the human being resides in the anticipatory resolution of being for death. But the mere concept of project already anticipates that priority of the future that gives meaning to the past. — David Mo
I'm surprised you don't know this. — David Mo
What he affirms is their continuous interaction in lived time (temporality). This is a triviality. What s — David Mo
What seems more radical is to say that his interpretation of temporality is the authentic and original temporal mode. — David Mo
I have not seen Heidegger present any evidence of this. — David Mo
No one is making any claims like this about his interpretation. — Xtrix
The question pertained to time, not theory or perception. — Xtrix
True, but according to epistemology and psychology mere perception is influenced by theoretical conceptions. If you describe a perception you will include those theoretical elements. And this is true for Aristotle or Heidegger.Perception is not theory. — Xtrix
Heidegger says that the future is the primordial existential ecstasis. — David Mo
Here it is. Underlined by Heidegger himself.Temporality is primordial, not just the future. — Xtrix — Xtrix
Primordial and authentic temporality temporalizes itself in terms of the authentic future and in such a way that in having been futurally, it first of all awakens the Present. The primary phenomenon of primordial and authentic temporality is the future. The priority of the future will vary according to the ways in which the temporalizing of inauthentic temporality itself is modified, but it will still come to the fore even in the derivative kind of 'time'. (B&T, #65, 330/378: cursive by Heidegger)
And how do I grasp or think about time if not through perception or theory? Divine inspiration?
Heidegger himself repeatedly calls his theory an analysis. If I remember correctly, he also calls it an interpretation. Analyzing and interpreting are ways of theorizing. Here and in China. — David Mo
No one is making any claims like this about his interpretation. — Xtrix
The question pertained to time, not theory or perception.
— Xtrix
Perception is not theory.
— Xtrix
True, but according to epistemology and psychology mere perception is influenced by theoretical conceptions. If you describe a perception you will include those theoretical elements. And this is true for Aristotle or Heidegger. — David Mo
Heidegger says that the future is the primordial existential ecstasis.
— David Mo
Temporality is primordial, not just the future. — Xtrix
— Xtrix — David Mo
Here it is. Underlined by Heidegger himself.
Primordial and authentic temporality temporalizes itself in terms of the authentic future and in such a way that in having been futurally, it first of all awakens the Present. The primary phenomenon of primordial and authentic temporality is the future. The priority of the future will vary according to the ways in which the temporalizing of inauthentic temporality itself is modified, but it will still come to the fore even in the derivative kind of 'time'. (B&T, #65, 330/378: cursive by Heidegger)
Hey, are you sure that what you have read with so much effort is Being and Time? — David Mo
Temporality is primordial, it's what the ordinary concept of time emerges from. The future is one aspect of temporality, and a particularly important one in Heidegger. — Xtrix
You turn the discussion upside down so much that one ends up not knowing what one is talking about.Perception is not theory. Perceiving shapes and colors is very different indeed from theory. — Xtrix
I’ll be back when I’m retired.My personal opinion is that no one can really interpret Heidegger clearly without at least 6 months or so of reading. — Xtrix
Heidegger suggest repetitively -if not claims- that Aristotelian-Cartesian concept of time is "theoretical" against his "authentic" concept of "temporality". This is false. His concept is as theoretical as Aristotelian. In the fact he himself recognizes it. He affirms that his interpretation has to "violate" the common sense of time. ("When violences are done in this field of investigation..." B&T: 326/374). It wouldn't be so grave if he were able to give some reason of this "violence" as he pretends. He is not. — David Mo
Therefore, the pure description of phenomena that Heidegger and other phenomenologists pretend is impossible. We describe phenomena in a culture mediated background. — David Mo
Heidegger suggest repetitively -if not claims- that Aristotelian-Cartesian concept of time is "theoretical" against his "authentic" concept of "temporality". — David Mo
His concept is as theoretical as Aristotelian. — David Mo
One of the things Heidegger must justify theoretically is why the future is the primary mode within temporality, in preference to the past and present. — David Mo
(If you agreed with this, why did you argue? Why on earth did you add the superfluous consideration that temporality is "also" primary? It's just a desire to tangle things!). — David Mo
Heidegger's reason is purely theoretical. It depends on his concept of the priority of the anticipatory resolution of life before death. This is a Heidegger's very subjective theory that, as in others, is influenced by his Christian education. And it is rationally unjustifiable. — David Mo
When I read those parts in S und Z I kind of understood it as H was trying to formalize the feeling You get when “thinking of time”. Time as it appears to the dasein. Augenblick and all that. But I am no pro. — Ansiktsburk
Heidegger has ever -- not once -- claimed the opposite. Neither have I. — Xtrix
Heidegger never says his CONCEPT of temporality is "authentic." Never. Apparently he talked about authentic and inauthentic temporality, which in my view doesn't mean much -- but that's not the same thing. — Xtrix
If you agree with me, what are you discussing with me?In the sense that you're taking "theory," how could it be otherwise? Of course interpretation and description is involved. Language is involved. Thinking is involved. — Xtrix
No kidding! I thought we were discussing the sex of angels! Thanks for warning us. Now, be nice, and explain to us one of those reasons the book is full of. One is enough for me. Because I have a malevolent suspicion that you can't do it. But I already say it's malevolent. You can easily disprove it. Sure.He does have an argument for this, consisting of many pages of words in a book called "Being and Time," — Xtrix
In the meantime, the fact that Heidegger blames the Aristotelian conception of time because it was "theoretical" suggests that he considered his own interpretation free of these theoretical elements. Is that so? — David Mo
Now, be nice, and explain to us one of those reasons the book is full of. One is enough for me. — David Mo
Is it possible motion does not go to time, but Time comes from the future to motion. Modern physics has many theories. Philosophy was the start — Gregory
He's not blaming Aristotle. It's not that Aristotle has it "wrong" and he has it "right." He's not saying that. — Xtrix
Being must enable us to show that the central problematic of all ontology is rooted in the phenomenon of time, if rightly seen and rightly explained, and we must show how this is the case. (B&T:18/40; Cursive by Heidegger)
This task as a whole requires that the conception of time thus obtained shall be ditinguished from the way in which it is ordinarily understood. This ordinary way of understanding it has become explicit in an interpretation precipitated in the traditional concept of time, which has persisted from Aristotle to Bergson and even later. (18/39)
What is characteristic of the 'time' which is accessible to the ordinary understanding, consists, among other things, precisely in the fact that it is a pure sequence of "nows", without beginning and without end, in which the ecstatical character of primordial temporality has been levelled off. (329/377)
Our analysis of primordial temporality up to this point may be summarized in the following theses. Time is primordial as the temporalizing of temporality, and as such it makes possible the Constitution of the structure of care. Temporality is essentially ecstatical. Temporality temporalizes itself primordially out of the future. Primordial time is finite. (331/380)
Get involved in philosophical discussions about knowledge, truth, language, consciousness, science, politics, religion, logic and mathematics, art, history, and lots more. No ads, no clutter, and very little agreement — just fascinating conversations.