But again, it's not the crime - it's the arrest. — counterpunch
The crime is irrelevant - except insofar as it indicates a propensity to resist arrest. — counterpunch
If there are disproportionately more poor black people than poor white people then inequality could be the explanation. For example if 90% of black people are poor compared to 70% of white people, and if being poor is a motivator to committing violent crimes, then there will be disproportionately more black violent criminals than white violent criminals. What's your alternative suggestion? That black people are genetically predisposed to violence, and that racial disparities in income and poverty are incidental? — Michael
Which raises the obvious question: why does anyone rent? Because owning is priced out of their range, because owning is not just a place to live, it's a way to get free money from other people who need a place to live, so people who have more money than they need for their immediate expenses are incentivized to buy housing just to rent it out, which makes owning more expensive, making more people stuck renting, which makes owning even more valuable to those who can afford it, raising the price of ownership, etc in a vicious cycle. — Pfhorrest
I don't follow this. Getting something for nothing (nothing of their own at least) is exactly what capitalists do capitalism for. Being able to generate profit just from owning things that other people have to pay you to use is the core of capitalism. — Pfhorrest
Oh. He's looking to "own" a leftist. They don't have many forums open to them these days — frank
Labour needs another Blair - not another Corbyn, because the working man wants capitalism with a social conscience; not to seize the means of production. He has no such aspiration. He never has done. All that Marxian bullshit is another middle class idea of the working class interest - like political correctness. If Labour ever want power again, they need a centrist pitch - like Blair's Third Way. Not political correctness, nothing to the left of Clause IV, but a practical pitch for government that recognises the value of business, so that he can go out and earn a decent living. — counterpunch
You demand I answer for the actions of my ancestors? My working class ancestors built the Labour Party from nothing to represent their interests relative to the owners of the means of production. And you've abandoned us, to weep bitterly and constantly on behalf of everyone but us - while the owners of the means of production have privatised everything, sold off council housing, destroyed the unions, cut pensions, ended job security, imposed zero hours contracts...etc, etc, and I'd still vote for them before a Labour Party overrun by people like you! — counterpunch
The implied claim here is that the disparity can be explained by different behaviour when faced with arrest. Do you have evidence for that? — Echarmion
I know it's not currently against the rules, but repeatedly making specific factual claims without even an attempt at citation or support (as counterpunch is doing here) is just wasting forum space. — Isaac
I cited evidence; albeit somewhat anecdotal. — counterpunch
The facts cited are from the Bureau of Justice Statistics - data sets from 2003-2012. — counterpunch
There are plenty of poor white people. They don't commit murder at 6 times the national average. — counterpunch
BLM used carefully edited cell phone footage to create a social media narrative to suggest that police were murdering black people — counterpunch
, but give yourself up to police and they won't kill you. — counterpunch
Or they are more likely to resist arrest - thereby endangering the police officer or members of the public. — counterpunch
The raw data doesn't show that:
unarmed black people are 3.49 times more likely to be shot. — counterpunch
various demographic and factors have been ASSUMED, — counterpunch
Violent offenders are more likely to get shot. — counterpunch
we messed around with the raw data until we proved our own politically correct assumptions." — counterpunch
There are plenty of poor white people.[enough to affect the conclusion that] Inequality isn't the explanation. — counterpunch
. (If you'd like I can dig up a Youtube video from a political scientist in support of this analysis of the split). And it winds up having people who're talking worker-populist points rallying to support people whose policies go against those points. — fdrake
"The market" is not something that exists like a market in your local town. It's a theoretical model that explains the formation of price according to supply and demand, if certain conditions are met.
In another sense, a "market" is just a descriptive term for transactions that happen in a specific region or concerning a specific ware.
In either case all that a market can be said to control is the price and distribution of goods, but not who profits from their production, how they use those profits etc. — Echarmion
All of these claims require support. There's absolutely no point in maintaining an internet space to act as nothing more than a selective database of what some random people reckon might be the case. — Isaac
George Floyd resisted arrest — counterpunch
How does racism and anti-semitism enter his worldview? Racial diversity just magnifies his sense of living on unstable ground? — frank
Just reading through this thread, it seems to me that the site rules would benefit from something against this sort of posting habit. I know it's not currently against the rules, but repeatedly making specific factual claims without even an attempt at citation or support (as counterpunch is doing here) is just wasting forum space. — Isaac
Even if this was a scientific journal, any breakthrough requires taking accepted thought and jumping up and down on it until it is no longer recognized as truth. — synthesis
But I do have a problem with political correctness - not least that it leaves people like me, lacking political representation. — counterpunch
The market is more than just price discovery as anybody who has been cancelled can attest. It's an all encompassing force that players on all sides attempt to manipulate to their own advantage. — synthesis
Regardless of how we wish to define it, I believe we can both agree that the freer the market, the more the price of any commodity reflects the actual value contained (which is most important to having a highly efficient economy). — synthesis
I cited anecdotal evidence for the idea that resisting arrest is more likely to get you shot. — counterpunch
Resisting arrest is not an explanation for murdering someone *after* they're cuffed. Condoning racist murder with such obviously flawed argumentation is disgusting. — Kenosha Kid
The restraint may have contributed to his death. — counterpunch
Labour were built by my forefathers to represent me, but I cant vote for a Labour party overrun with politically correct, far left ideologues. They don't represent me, they represent blacks, gays, women, trannies - anyone before me. — counterpunch
May have? It was videoed. You are without doubt the most disgusting individual I've ever really encountered, conversationally speaking. — Kenosha Kid
The fact is, you don't know what the cause of death was, and deciding whether it was murder is absolutely not your call. — counterpunch
Watch it and tell me, if it was your job to arrest that man - would you keep him restrained? — counterpunch
I think you're just a bigot. — frank
I'm the white working class majority that Labour used to represent, but now don't — counterpunch
Government should buy up all the poor quality housing stock, demolish it - and build more and better housing on the same site, and then have a government backed rental/ownership scheme - where the money is ploughed back in to fund the purchase of poor quality housing stock, and the building of more and better housing. Self financing solution to the housing crisis! — counterpunch
in many Third World countries, the end result is too few housing is built and that what is built is likely built only for the richest buyers. Others live in cramped housing and on rent. And when large segment of the population are forced to rent, then in the end of their lives they have nothing to give to the next generation. — ssu
the ability for even ordinary people to save by investing in a flat or two — ssu
They won't invest, if there's the possibility of very punitive legislation to "help" those who rent. — ssu
In order to do this you'd have to plop down a significant amount of cash and likely cash out investments. — BitconnectCarlos
You discriminate against people like me - with an ideology that makes me last in line because I'm a straight white male — counterpunch
Get involved in philosophical discussions about knowledge, truth, language, consciousness, science, politics, religion, logic and mathematics, art, history, and lots more. No ads, no clutter, and very little agreement — just fascinating conversations.