Where were you hiding all that time? :grin:People who believe their mind is their brain or that their self is their body have either swallowed the scientism lie or are too scared to think about life after material death — Ambrosia
Well, you are one in a million! (Actually, one among the ~25 people who responded to the topic! :smile:)And your right,it's not to do with thinking. It's obvious and Intuitive. — Ambrosia
Of course not. I never stop saying that (in different words!)Never trust scientists on these matters! — Ambrosia
Isn't yourself, the person I communicate with, the human being, ... all one? Aren't these things YOU? If not what else are they?Do you consider youself, a person a human being something arbitrary?
— Alkis Piskas
These do not relate to each other. — Mww
Right. It doesn't.This only works if realization does not involve understanding. — Mww
As it looks, I can't (because I tried). Realization can sometimes happen with information --that's why I tried-- but it most often occurs at some usually unexpected moment.If you can’t inform me of how simple YOU is ... — Mww
OK, but can you also quote where does this refer to? Thanks.I think that in one sense you are correct. — Manuel
What else could I have in mind? :smile:If by "body" you have in mind what we commonly refer to as human bodies — Manuel
What could a more strict sense be and how else can you think of bodies? The kind of objects considered in Physics? Or something else?In a more strict sense, we don't know what bodies are. — Manuel
Of course you can't. You connect the body to the person. Even a dead body is still considered a person by the great majority of people. And even when a dead body is burried and it is eaten by worms and becomes just bones, or it is cremated, people still believe that these are the person himself. Do you think this is rational?I have yet to see a person existing absent a body. — Manuel
OK, thanks.But the main thrust of your argument is sensible. — Manuel
Panpsychism — Ambrosia
All things are full of gods. — Thales (first philosopher, first scientist)
Animism is different from panpsychism.
Do keep up old boy — Ambrosia
Animism has always been the primary religion of mankind,still is but in an occluded way. — Ambrosia
Some crafty animists made the gods/ancestors into one and then reified that "god" into an abstract concept or principle. But one that has effects. "The laws of nature".
The "grand theory of everything". — Ambrosia
Xenophones was a rascal and bullshitter. — Ambrosia
Today they are called doctors,lawyers,politicians priests and the supreme fake monotheistic God is the "Laws of nature". — Ambrosia
After all, do physical things exist in the absence of minds?
— praxis
It depends "who" would replace humans as to observe it I guess.
But I am not sure about the answer either. We, humans, name the world "physical" . But is it indeed or only what we can perceive?Our limited "reality"? And isn't " physical" just one more "human invention"? Named that way due to his limited sensations? I think that might be a discussion for another thread.
But for one thing we can be sure." Something" exists for sure!
For me, the existence of mind is the strongest evidence for humans that there is much more than we see . The way we can be so sure for our mind existence i always found it a really miracle!
That's why I think that physical (body-what we perceive) interacts with something non psychical (the whole "invisible world" that we can't perceive or we perceive it different, limited) . That interaction brings in life Mind.
Maybe Mind is Spirit after all. — dimosthenis9
OK, but can you also quote where does this refer to? Thanks. — Alkis Piskas
What could a more strict sense be and how else can you think of a bodies? The kind of objects considered in Physics? Or something else? — Alkis Piskas
Even a dead body is still considered a person by the great majority of people. — Alkis Piskas
Right!When you say:
"Right this person, is YOU. YOU, as a human being, the same YOU since you were born, ..."
I think that's correct. That's the idea of a self as distinct from a body, as I understand it. — Manuel
OK....how else can you think of a bodies? The kind of objects considered in Physics? Or something else?
— Alkis Piskas
Yes, mostly physics. — Manuel
Do you mean how the body and organism works?We have our intuition of what bodies are then there's the more in depth study of them. — Manuel
I don't believe that either. But I can't say what exactly each one feels after a loved person has gone. One moment you can hear them saying e.g. "He/she is now in heaven", etc. and the other moment speaking to them over the grave on their visits to the cemetery. Why do they need to go there? Can't they speak to them from any place?I don't think if you ask any of them is that thing in the casket an actual person, any of them would say that it is a person. — Manuel
...how else can you think of a bodies? The kind of objects considered in Physics? Or something else? — Manuel
OK, fair enough.I took exception only with the argument sustaining it, — Mww
1) Which argument specifically is this? (I have said a lot of things and brought in quite a few arguments to support my thesis.)I took exception only with the argument sustaining it, which is technically unsound for lack of critical thinking. — Mww
“iff it is true that an “I” is not the body in which it resides, then it is also true that all iterations of “I” are not the body in which it resides”. — Mww
Do you mean how the body and organism works? — Alkis Piskas
This subject brings in something else quite interesting: While persons are alive people believe that they are bodies and treat them as such, but after they die, and their body is burried or cremated, they believe that they continue to "live" and exist somewhere (as spirits, souls, etc.)? Do you think that this has someting to tell us? — Alkis Piskas
Panpsychism is an interesting view, I don't think it's correct, but it's worth thinking about and pursuing. — Manuel
I don't think it's a fact, it's a belief. You cannot show that atoms are conscious or experience something minimal. They may or they may not — Manuel
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