You can be a little tricksy Mr Jackson. I was not saying science had a shallow view of nature but I accept the old switcheroo attempt. — universeness
Particle in a field. Same thing, isn't it? — Jackson
Sorry, I did not understand your post — Jackson
For science, it is only the movement of particles — Jackson
Yes, I see now. — Jackson
House of Theory — Jack Cummins
The noetic side contributes memory and anticipation, the reaching out into the event with a framing expectation, the seeing, knowing aspect. But the noematic object that is seen , known , experienced, fills out the expectation but never completely fulfills it. Thus the metaphysical is a pole , a subjective contribution to the act of seeing and experiencing. But it can never subsist in itself as its own ‘context’. — Joshs
may be that people strive to come up with ideas and conceptual thought, but that emotions lurk behind the scenes more than many would care to admit. Likes and dislikes as attitudes and values may have such a strong power and influence in the development of rational thought. — Jack Cummins
I was comparing Rupert Sheldrake's 'morphic resonance' with Richard Dawkings coining and use of the term meme from his book 'The Selfish Gene.' — universeness
Murdoch does initially speak of the void in British politics. I do see her as describing what is happening rather than advocating for the elimination of metaphysics. — Jack Cummins
Murdoch describes a "progressive education in the virtues" which involves engaging in practices that turn our attention away from ourselves toward valuable objects in the real world. Citing Plato's Phaedrus, she identifies the experience of beauty as the most accessible and the easiest to understand. She attributes the "unselfing" power of beauty both to nature and to art. Also following Plato, she locates the next and more difficult practice in intellectual disciplines. She uses the example of learning a foreign language as the occasion to practice virtues such as honesty and humility while increasing one's knowledge of "an authoritative structure which commands my respect". She says that the same quality of outward objective attention to the particular is needed for developing and practicing virtues in ordinary human relations.
Murdoch argues that Plato's concept of the Good applies to and unifies all these ways of learning and practicing the virtues. In her discussion of the concept, she refers to three sections from Plato's Republic: the Analogy of the Sun, the Analogy of the Divided Line, and the Allegory of the Cave. The concept of Good, Murdoch says, involves perfection, hierarchy, and transcendence, and is both unifying and indefinable. She suggests that "a sort of contemplation of the Good" in the sense of "a turning away from the particular" is possible and "may be the thing that helps most when difficulties seem insoluble". However, this practice is difficult and carries with it the danger that the object of attention might revert to the self. — Wiki
Gerson contends that Platonism identifies philosophy with a distinct subject matter, namely, the intelligible world, and seeks to show that the Naturalist rejection of Platonism entails the elimination of a distinct subject matter for philosophy. Thus, the possibility of philosophy depends on the truth of Platonism. From Aristotle to Plotinus to Proclus, Gerson clearly links the construction of the Platonic system well beyond simply Plato's dialogues, providing strong evidence of the vast impact of Platonism on philosophy throughout history. Platonism and Naturalism concludes that attempts to seek a rapprochement between Platonism and Naturalism are unstable and likely indefensible.
And Plato himself requires huge erudition to read and interpret. — Wayfarer
Are you saying it's hard to find robust Plato scholars who can write from a perspective located somewhere between recherché and accessible pap? — Tom Storm
This may also be too breezy, but there's a Neo-Platonist Catholic philosopher on Youtube who who often recommends books on Plato. Check out Pat Flynn and Jim Madden (Benedictine College) - they love Gerson and various others.
What about Alain Badiou and Max Tegmark – not "robust Plato scholars" but nevertheless contemporary, rigorous 'platonists' in their own rights, respectively?Are you saying it's hard to find robust Plato scholars who can write from a perspective located somewhere between recherché and accessible pap? — Tom Storm
Dawkins and Sheldrake are poles apart. Read about this encounter between them. (I'm a Sheldrake admirer, actually had the good fortune to meet him and hear him speak in the early 90's. Of course he's regarded by establishment science as a maverick and crank, as many of those who argue against scientific materialism are. — Wayfarer
Tegmark is not a "physicalist" — 180 Proof
I know very little about Sheldrake but I did see common ground between his 'morphic resonance' label and Dawkins's' memes' label, both in functionality and proposed final result. Do you see any connection between the two? — universeness
For me, metaphysics is context. — Clarky
Metaphysics, to me, is about how you think about the world. Not in terms of truth, but what kind of thing it is. — Jackson
If you think about your own metaphysical leanings, do you detect emotion? What are they? What are they connected to? — Tate
Kant critiqued metaphysics. But he reduces metaphysics to epistemology. — Jackson
So traditional metaphysics can't be accomodated within that framework, as it's like trying to fit a three-dimensional form into a two-dimensional plane. — Wayfarer
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