Thoughts are cognitive states: believing, doubting, questioning, reasoning, guessing, comparing, etc.
Emotions (e.g. fear, joy, anger, disgust, surprise) are occurring sudden and spontaneous (non-deliberate) bodily/physiological reactions to what happens — neomac
Here's Pliny the Younger, witnessing the sudden, violent destruction of Pompeii:
“In the darkness you could hear the crying of women, the wailing of infants, and the shouting of men. Some prayed for help. Others wished for death. But still more imagined that there were no Gods left, and that the universe was plunged into eternal darkness.” — Joshua Jones
When worlds end, worldviews go with them - doubtless, in no small part due to the images burning in the minds of those who saw things they never wish to tell, but cannot unsee. So, while it's day, shouldn't we be collecting, testing, and distilling durable meaning, instead of arguing over whether or not we believe it will ever get dark? — Joshua Jones
↪Ciceronianus
I think some of the style comes from growing up in a dour religious household — Paine
...for Wittgenstein it cannot be profoundly different for each of us because experience is profoundly relational.
— Joshs
Sure, the box might be the same, but the beetle? — Banno
What if it were profoundly different for each of us?
— Joshs
...then enlightenment is enriched by not being limited.... — Banno
Why should enlightenment be the same for each of us? — Banno
It seems that in Nietzsche's view, there should exist a series of selves; one overcoming the other.
Whereas in some ideologies, enlightenment has to do with stopping the process of selfing altogether. — baker
To preface, it appears that these comments might be filled with pseudo-intellectuals that are want of confidence - seeing that many fail to engage with the question, and resort to condescension. It is a shame, and we may take pity on them. — Sean Staton
I know my thinking is conventional but I wonder why be different if it isn't in some greater sense, better? What is the impetus for transformation - is it being who you really are, which may not be an improvement? — Tom Storm
Surely Nietzsche would have said that "being who you really are" is preferable to not being who you really are. It seem to me this is where the existentialist notion of authenticity comes into play. — Janus
You don't understand it as an idea of flourishing, but simply of change, whether for the better or worse? — Janus
Does anyone have comments on Nietzsche's ideas of self-overcoming?
— Tom Storm
Someone once told me that it has to do with "being better than you were before". — baker
↪baker I think this is on the right track. Nietzsche conceived of the fundamental aim of all life to be, not merely survival, but power; by which I take him to mean, not power over others or physical strength, but power over oneself, over one's own desire for comfort, ease and distraction at the expense of flourishing and becoming the best you can be. — Janus
For me, the fundamental question is: How does anything ever feel anything at all? — GrahamJ
this wasn't intended to be a thread convincing people it was the end of the world. People come to a fire because they want heat, light and company - not to be convinced that they are cold, in the dark and lonely. — Joshua Jones
I am inspired by many thinkers who found themselves really tormented by the Fall of their Empires - Augustine, Boethius, Milton, DeLillo - there are countless others. And taking their thoughts as “dead trees of life” that we can chop into firewood - practical, applied insights - for heat and light in these times. — Joshua Jones
I think many of us are feeling like we are falling to pieces in both the singular and collective sense. — Joshua Jones
it seems that eudemonic pursuits such as purposefulness and desire originating in a greater desire for happiness is a primary motivator in most types of rationally guided behavior, primarily through associative memory of moments associated with peak experiences that stand out from the rest. — Shawn
in prediction-based approaches affectivity is bound up with the relationship one senses between anticipation and realization.
— Joshs
In this case isn’t affect hedonic (relating to or considered in terms of pleasant or unpleasant interoception)? — praxis
If you could put it into simple straightforward language that would be appreciated. Thanks — Ross
what about Aristotle's ethics or virtue ethics, neither are not a rigid system of rules or codes to live by. They emphasis the importance of developing a good character , that's their end goal and they do not include a prescription of what one most do or believe in. — Ross
Is it rather the case that many of these philosophical systems of ethics and morality whether it's Aristotle's or Plato's ethics or Kant's moral theory that they are a goal or set of ideas for humanity to aspire to. An attempt to construct a framework of values by which a society or even an individual can live by without any such framework it would be almost anarchical. Isn't Aristotle correct that human beings are fundamentally social beings and therefore in the matter of ethics and values that it's important to see them in a SOCIAL context, to provide a some kind of guide to how human beings can flourish not only as individuals but also crucially to live together with a common set of moral values. But Nietzsche attacks all forms of moralizing altogether. Is he correct here or is it being unrealistic? — Ross
How is affect somehow not hedonic? — praxis
Consistency is about truth. If you don't care about the truth, and you don't need to, consistency be damned! That's in classical logic though. If you're interested in not just the truth but about how our minds work, you should abandon a zero tolerance attitude towards inconsistency. — TheMadFool
If our minds rejected inconsistencies i.e. if it were incapable of cognitive dissonance, how would that impact/affect our lives — TheMadFool
On the most basic level, studies show that without reward (pleasure) and punishment (pain) we really wouldn’t be motivated to do much of anything. — praxis
knowledge can only be grounded in what can be experienced by the senses
— Wayfarer
Considering that it would be impossible to know anything without such a grounding it’s really not that unreasonable. — praxis
Much the same thing was developed at the same time by Russel, Wittgenstein et al. but without the metaphysical nonsense. — Banno
Frege’s logic forms a simple language of predicates, allowing us to see the supposition of attributing predicates to individuals at the base of language.
But unfortunately this insight here fell into the fog of phenomenology, which tries to found existence on sensations rather than on language, and ends up confusing being with time and failing to clarify much of anything. — Banno
↪TheMadFool I was just explaining what Josh posted, which would make no sense whatsoever if you didn’t know the German idiom Heidegger refers to. No, the point is not to study grammar to understand being. — Srap Tasmaner
Why does this happen? What's distinct/unique about Being that requires us to be, well, expert linguists with in-depth knowledge of, curiously, not semantics but syntax. :chin: The objective was to go into meaning (of Being) and instead we're neck-deep in grammar. — TheMadFool
Every time Being is analyzed, it takes a distinct form, a linguistic one - necessary language concepts for such examinations/studies being verb, predicate, verbal nouns, pseudo-objects, to name but a few. — TheMadFool
People want efficient public transit — not cars. — Xtrix
Change is the effect of a Cause. — Gnomon
It's the brain talking to itself about its environment. I am not you, because you're in my environment. — Kenosha Kid
That there are multiple points of entry for the sensory data and that they are at some point processed into a single experience doesn't seem to offer support for the direct realist position. — Hanover
I don’t know if any of this factors into it, but for me the locus of perception is the entire organism
— NOS4A2
That's just scientifically incorrect. My nose doesn't see things, nor does my pancreas. — Hanover
I intuit a certain object if I already know what the word I heard represents, or I do not intuit a certain object, — Mww
.........I have now extracted the meaning of the word iff I already know the object to which it relates. — Mww
Wittgenstein says that we only ever actually experience a word in its contextual use.
— Joshs
I don’t think so. To experience a word is to treat it as a mere object, by which we first perceive it, then subject the word to the cognitive process, resulting in the experience of it. Better to say we only ever understand a word in its contextual use. — Mww
he would be motivated by reason generally, but being void of emotion, he would have no use for pure practical reason. In effect, it could be said he was void of pure practical reason and that’s why he had no emotions. There was nothing to inform him of what his emotions should be. Or it could just as well be that he had no emotion so there was nothing on which practical reason could exert itself. — Mww
↪Mww
Emotions serve our aesthetic judgements, having to do only with the condition of the thinking subject, whether a thing feels right/wrong or feels good/bad, whether or not it is right or good or not, but not that to which the subject attends, the thing that must be either right/wrong or good/bad.
Feelings/cognitions are nothing but another inescapable duality intrinsic to the human condition. Even if humans operate under the influence of both, that is not to say they are inseparable from each other.
— Mww
You say that to which the subject attends is separate from emotion. Let’s remove emotion from the equation for a moment , since it’s connotation as florid and intense response is not what I want to focus on. Rather , I want to focus on feeling as not just simple sensation but as intrinsic to the aesthetic judgments you described above. So you are arguing that we can extract the meaning of a word concept that is independent of all feelings that may accompany our experience of that word.
Wittgenstein says that we only ever actually experience a word in its contextual use. That means it is always a different sense of the meaning of that word which we experience in any given situation. What this further implies is that the use of the word isnt something additional to its pre-assigned intrinsic meaning. For Wittgenstein there is no intrinsic meaning to a word apart from its sense ( usage). So how and why it matters to us is the very essence of its meaning. If you are claiming that this pragmatic mattering and relevance is the province of feeling, and feeling can be separated from cognition, then you would seem to be disagreeing with Wittgenstein about the separability of mattering-use from the intrinsic meaning of word concepts — Joshs
Emotions serve our aesthetic judgements, having to do only with the condition of the thinking subject, whether a thing feels right/wrong or feels good/bad, whether or not it is right or good or not, but not that to which the subject attends, the thing that must be either right/wrong or good/bad.
Feelings/cognitions are nothing but another inescapable duality intrinsic to the human condition. Even if humans operate under the influence of both, that is not to say they are inseparable from each other. — Mww
