↪Mark S Ninth thread on the same topic; same problem as the first thread:

At the core, that we do cooperate does not imply that we ought cooperate.
— Banno — Banno

There's no such thing as life without bloodshed. I think the notion that the species can be improved in some way, that everyone could live in harmony, is a really dangerous idea. Those who are afflicted with this notion are the first ones to give up their souls, their freedom. Your desire that it be that way will enslave you and make your life vacuous. — Cormac McCarthy, d. 2023 (today)

You give up the world line by line. Stoically. And then one day you realize that your courage is farcical. It doesnt mean anything. You've become an accomplice in your own annihilation and there is nothing you can do about it. Everything you do closes a door somewhere ahead of you. And finally there is only one door left. — The Sunset Limited (2006)

The problem is that this means the only way out is through. — schopenhauer1

The case against him is not regarding his time in office. It's about the records he stole, hid, and lied about possessing after leaving office. — creativesoul

Regardless, though, the indictment isn't limited to the PRA or civil remedies available under it. It involves violation of the Espionage Act, obstruction, and other criminal matters. — Ciceronianus

All of this then implies that it was best to not have this brought about in the first place. — schopenhauer1

It's not worth the bother of killing yourself or refusing to procreate, since you always kill yourself and go extinct as a species too late.

How about a man/boy who no longer consents to be a man/boy?
And of course a woman/girl who no longer consents to being one? — universeness

I believe that humans should be treated as if we are special. — Andrew4Handel

I don’t think he broke the law nor do I care if he did.
— NOS4A2

Well that just says everything — Michael

(Update pending on imminent US Federal indictments for Obstruction of Justice, Espionage, etc.) — 180 Proof

I was shocked by the degree of sensitivity of these documents and how many there were, frankly. If even half of it is true, then he is toast. It's a very detailed indictment and it's very very damning. And this idea of presenting Trump as a victim, a victim of a witch hunt, is ridiculous. Yes, he's been a victim in the past. Yes, his adversaries have obsessively pursued him with phony claims, and I've been at his side defending against them when he is a victim. But this is much different. He's not a victim here. He was totally wrong. — fmr US AG (and Trump-fixer) Bill Barr, FOX Noise 11Jun23

it is an extremely damning indictment ... this is not an indictment that you can dismiss. It's really breathtaking. Obviously, this is mishandling, you know, putting classified documents into ballrooms and bathrooms is -- it borders on the bizarre. ... the visual and audio tape evidence is really daunting.

There are indictments that are sometimes called narrative or speaking indictments. These are indictments that are really meant to make a point as to the depth of the evidence, there are some indictments that are just bare bones. This is not one of those indictments. The Special Counsel knew that there would be a lot of people who were going to allege that the Department of Justice was acting in a biased or politically motivated way. This is clearly an indictment that was drafted to answer those questions. It's overwhelming in detail.

The Trump team should not fool itself. These are hits below the waterline. These are witnesses who apparently testified under oath [and] gave statements to federal investigators, both of which can be criminally charged, if they're false. Those witnesses are directly quoting the president in encouraging others not to look for documents or allegedly to conceal them. It's damaging.

It's hard to show a picture of these boxes surrounding a toilet and saying ‘we really acted responsibly'. The government is bringing dozens of counts – they only have to land one of those punches. Keep in mind that every one of these counts is coming with a substantial potential sentence. — Jonathan Turley, MAGA legal spin-master, FOX Noise 9Jun23

↪180 Proof It's not meaningless, you just don't agree with it. — RogueAI

Discursive metacognition.
— 180 Proof

Do you class this as a physical or mental attribute? — Andrew4Handel

Whether or not you believe it's morally wrong is irrelevant. What he [Trump] did was criminal. He knew it too. — creativesoul

What do you think is Trump’s egregious crime?
— NOS4A2

There's more than one. Care to discuss?

Counts 1 through 31. Willful retention of national defense information
Count 32. Conspiracy to obstruct justice
Count 33. Withholding a document or record
Count 34. Corruptly concealing a document or record
Count 35. Concealing a document in a federal investigation
Count 36. Scheme to conceal
Count 37. False statements and representations
Count 38. False statements and representations — creativesoul

I can't lie to you about your chances, but... you have my sympathies. — Ash, a severed head

On the other hand, Varoufakis and Cornel West think well of him, and these are serious people. — Manuel

... mind and consciousness don't exist or are illusions. — RogueAI

How does how we live change if idealism is true? — Tom Storm